ID's as Early 1800s royal company of archers gilt button

Please post any finds here that you wish help with identification.
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Lowland
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ID's as Early 1800s royal company of archers gilt button

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:45 am

Hi all
Would really appreciate some help with this one.
Can't find it online ..
I think it's a livery button ,but is smaller
24 mm compared to all the others at 27 mm.
'spose cld be a cuff button?
Came out of a stubble field yesterday in Berwickshire.
GMP set to twelve o clock
Auto off.
New bracket on for forward mounting control box(big difference in stubble...coil doesn't skite over the top as much)
The design features a bow and two arrows with a thistle either side and topped with a crown.
Also the backstamp is a manufacturer I can't see online either
Looks like calfe & willis,new Bond Street,London.
Expertise greatly appreciated
Thanks for looking
LL
IMG_841.jpg
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Last edited by Lowland on Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Another livery button ? Totally stumped -help please

Post by Euro Detector » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:34 am

Really nice condition. ::g Can't find anything though for (S)calfe & Willis, although there were several manufacturers in the late 18th and early 19th century in New Bond Street, London.
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Re: Another livery button ? Totally stumped -help please

Post by fred » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:42 am

That looks like a Royal Crown which would be unusual on a livery button so I would initially look for an organisation, possibly military. If I had to guess at this early stage I would say it was from the The Royal Company of Archers or somebody very closely associated with it and date it to the first half of the 19thC. ::g

This one has some of the symbols of yours. Most units had several buttons on the go at the same time for different forms of dress as well as for different ranks.

http://www.jonnywilliamson.com/product/ ... circa-1822

And another detecting discussion. The link to the auction site doesn't help.:

http://www.detectingscotland.com/index. ... ic=12518.0
Last edited by fred on Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Another livery button ? Totally stumped -help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:52 am

fred wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:42 am
That looks like a Royal Crown which would be unusual on a livery button so I would initially look for an organisation, possibly military. If I had to guess at this early stage I would say it was from the The Royal Company of Archers or somebody very closely associated with it and date it to the first half of the 19thC. ::g
Thanks Fred
When I first saw it I thought royal company of archers!
Their buttons are different ,but I like the idea of a close association.
You're right datewise I think ,it has the look of quite an early one,compared to others I have.

The field it came out of is reputed to be a 'camp' field..it is right on top o a hill.
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Re: Another livery button ? Totally stumped -help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:59 am

Cheers for the link...that's s a tidy button.
The archers apparently were active from 1676 till present day.(Wikipedia)
And were personal bodyguard to George IV on his state visit to Scotland in 1822.
Fascinating history with ties to the area I'm in...
Would be nice if this button was associated .
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Re: Another livery button ? Totally stumped -help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:05 am

Better pic of the front and reverse!
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Euro Detector » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:18 am

The new images helped! I believe it reads "Scaife & Willis" instead of "Calfe & Willis". There are only very few hits on search engines for "Scaife & Willis", but these few do refer to London.
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:34 am

Euro Detector wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:18 am
The new images helped! I believe it reads "Scaife & Willis" instead of "Calfe & Willis". There are only very few hits on search engines for "Scaife & Willis", but these few do refer to London.
So it does!
Should've looked harder at the new photos as well
Thanks for that
Edit to say-have looked up family names that I can find associated with the archers, lots of arrow crests but not this one!
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by madproffesor » Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:32 am

Looks like two thistles at the bottom, could it have a Scottish connection? :-/
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:51 am

Hi
More than likely-
'Twas found in Berwickshire
Just on the England Scotland border....
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:20 pm

Scaife and Willis woolen drapers
New Bond Street
London
In 1811
From the tradesman volume 6.
Also
Arthur scaife
And
George Willis
Dissolves partnership with Thomas Willis
In 1811
On 19th of January.
From the gazette
Which has them as woollen drapers,man mercers and tailors
Last edited by Lowland on Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:16 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Euro Detector » Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:23 pm

Mystery solved. ::g
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:29 pm

Euro Detector wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:23 pm
Mystery solved. ::g
Solved the reverse anyway!!
Cheers
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Euro Detector » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:08 pm

It must be very rare, too. :))
The only button I find with some similarity to yours is this one (thistle wreath surmounted by a crown, bow and arrows are missing):
http://www.ukdfd.co.uk/ukdfddata/showre ... ot&cat=217
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:27 pm

Euro Detector wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:08 pm
It must be very rare, too. :))
The only button I find with some similarity to yours is this one (thistle wreath surmounted by a crown, bow and arrows are missing):
http://www.ukdfd.co.uk/ukdfddata/showre ... ot&cat=217
Blimey
Nicely done
It is the same barring the centre motif.
You're like a terminator! ):=
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Just tried their crest...but no luck
But close one...
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by DiOz » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:46 pm

A similar button found in the US....
http://www.treasurequestxlt.com/communi ... ton.64820/
....Dave. n;

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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Euro Detector » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:49 pm

I'd say that's a match ::g
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by fred » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:55 pm

Euro Detector wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:49 pm
I'd say that's a match ::g
Unfortunately they came to the same inconclusive conclusion as we all have. :D

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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by Lowland » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:11 pm

fred wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:55 pm
Euro Detector wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:49 pm
I'd say that's a match ::g
Unfortunately they came to the same inconclusive conclusion as we all have. :D
Cheers everybody....
Conclusive conclusions are better.,. x;
This is a tricky one.
Would one showing up in the USA point more to a military button?
Mebbe not...
Glad I got a good sleep last night!
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Re: Another livery button? Or military help please

Post by DiOz » Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:53 pm

Lowland wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:11 pm
Would one showing up in the USA point more to a military button?
It's not a family livery button.
....Dave. n;

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