The importance of search coil weight?

Topics related to Nexus metal detectors here, Off topic posts will be removed.
NEXUS Videos
Nexus
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 10:58 pm
Has thanked: 43 times
Been thanked: 5 times

The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Nexus » Mon May 08, 2017 6:13 pm

I would please like everyones opinion on search coil weight. How important is for you and what would be the best weight for the suggested coil sizes below;

10"DD, 13"DD, 15"DD, 20"DD or similar concentric coil sizes. Any other coil size mentioned is welcome.

With the 11.5" concentric Nexus coil prototype reaching just 280 grams I wonder how close is this figure to your idea of preferred search coil weight?

User avatar
the-roman
Posts: 679
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:56 pm
Location: Somerset
Has thanked: 4 times
Been thanked: 37 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by the-roman » Mon May 08, 2017 7:23 pm

I suppose it depends on how much detecting time you want in the field mate. if the coil is too heavy then you can use a harness bungee, but thats not for me personally. I only tend to use a 9" or 11" depending on where I am going and ground conditions etc, but I can do all day with either coil. I have used much larger ones in the past but never really gained anything apart from more ground coverage. the small elliptical coils are brilliant in the right conditions. so I guess it's down to what ground type to are detecting on and for how long you want in the field. not sure this is any help to you really ::g
Only the best, XP Goldmaxx power .... F.I.D member ::g
And a proud member of the best club in Somerset, Wessex Searchers MDC ::g
www.wessexsearchers.club

WVAM
Posts: 342
Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 9:13 pm
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 64 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by WVAM » Mon May 08, 2017 9:26 pm

If I knew how long the piece of string is I could give you an answer to your question.
To know what the desired weight should be you would need to know the conditions of use (as said by the-roman), the stem length, stature of the person etc. etc. The user would have needed to try even lighter coils to work out their best weight.
If you are just saying you have light coils then great, just say that and let folks choose. If you want an answer to the question you'll need to supply a group of users with a range of coils for a year of detecting and you might get close to an answer - although I doubt you'll get much more than "it felt really light". And, sometimes things can be too light for the situation.

Hauptmann aD
Posts: 191
Joined: Tue May 03, 2011 2:44 pm
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Hauptmann aD » Mon May 08, 2017 10:16 pm

Depends from your constitution, from the detectors total balancing, your swing method and the time you spend swinging on a detecting day. Even from the number of finds, since if you change often between swinging and digging, this helps too.
After several hours even the lightest coil may cause pain on your wrist.
*Salute*
Olaf

sweepstick47
Posts: 4789
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:21 pm
Location: North Lincolnshire
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 230 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by sweepstick47 » Mon May 08, 2017 10:35 pm

Without wishing to make 'light of it', I'd say the reply by 'WVAM' sums it up well. However, if there now follows a number of meaningful replies, I've completely misjudged it! :-SS Regards ss47
Arado 130 - Garrett Groundhog - Tesoro Eldorado - Fisher 1265X - Goldmax Power Makro Racer. Homemade Harness!

User avatar
Saffron
Posts: 1247
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:09 pm
Has thanked: 145 times
Been thanked: 205 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Saffron » Mon May 08, 2017 11:26 pm

In my view the balance of the coil is much more important than the weight.

A well balanced coil will be much easier to use for long periods than a lighter one that is poorly balanced.

Evan

Koala
Posts: 2614
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:47 pm
Location: Cheshire
Has thanked: 63 times
Been thanked: 194 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Koala » Tue May 09, 2017 12:05 am

Some of the old style coils were too light if you were detecting in water.


You can't push an old Whites 8" under. One manual advises you to weigh it down with a sock of sand.

:D :D :D


Getting back on topic. If you regularly swing a coil your arm soon gets use to it. Most of the 12"and under can be swung all day.

dobybowers
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 10:28 pm
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by dobybowers » Tue May 09, 2017 4:31 am

Personally, detector balance is more important than coil weight. I can take a 4 lb detector that is perfectly balanced over a 2 lb detector that is not.
Don.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whites 5900, XLT, Nautilus DMCiib, Tesoro Cibola, Nexus Credo
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

toni
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:21 am
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 23 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by toni » Tue May 09, 2017 9:27 am

Time and practice would show. It may be an advantage.
If there was a functional long range locator 50kg, I would wear it.
The spool can have the advantage of deep detectors. If there is a difference of 1-3 kg.
The first explorer coils were difficult, but they were the best.

User avatar
liamnolan
Moderator
Posts: 9077
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:06 am
Location: Norwich - originally from Dublin, southern Ireland
Has thanked: 141 times
Been thanked: 153 times
Contact:

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by liamnolan » Tue May 09, 2017 10:09 am

As already stated, the important factor is balance. My work is all about tennis, squash and badminton rackets, changing the strings but also customising them for overall weight, balance and dynamic weight or "swingweight" The SW is the mixture of weight and balance along the 27 ins length of the racket frame. I use the Deus with 9 ins coil and its very light to swing. If I used a bigger heavier coil then I would not find it as comfortable to swing all day. The more weight in the coil the more work for the arm and shoulder. Summer approaches and so our fields will be in stubble and I find the Deus coil struggles to move as its so light, so a heavier coil would get a bit lower, though the balance would be off. The older bigger control boxes acted as a counterweight against the coil weight and although the machines might be heavy the balance was good enough to all a full days detecting without the arm falling off.
Liam OooO
Deus, WSi's - In the end we will regret the chances we didn't take, the relationships we were afraid to have and the decisions we waited too long to make .. Secretary Irish Metal Detecting Society IMDS

Ten pence!
Posts: 742
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:42 pm
Has thanked: 38 times
Been thanked: 25 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Ten pence! » Tue May 09, 2017 11:22 am

As light as possibe should be the answer to any questions about oversize search coils, I've found all the larger aftermarket and OE coils did upset the balance of the machine, the extra momentum needed to swing an overweight coild might not seem to be a problem in your front room but it will be a different story after three hours in the field.

As you can probably tell I'm no fan of monster coils or indeed the marginal and sometimes non existent performance gains!

sweepstick47
Posts: 4789
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:21 pm
Location: North Lincolnshire
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 230 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by sweepstick47 » Tue May 09, 2017 10:04 pm

liamnolan wrote:
Tue May 09, 2017 10:09 am
As already stated, the important factor is balance. My work is all about tennis, squash and badminton rackets, changing the strings but also customising them for overall weight, balance and dynamic weight or "swingweight" The SW is the mixture of weight and balance along the 27 ins length of the racket frame. I use the Deus with 9 ins coil and its very light to swing. If I used a bigger heavier coil then I would not find it as comfortable to swing all day. The more weight in the coil the more work for the arm and shoulder. Summer approaches and so our fields will be in stubble and I find the Deus coil struggles to move as its so light, so a heavier coil would get a bit lower, though the balance would be off. The older bigger control boxes acted as a counterweight against the coil weight and although the machines might be heavy the balance was good enough to all a full days detecting without the arm falling off.
Liam OooO
Hello Liam, Your's is a good analogy. ::g
Perhaps the phrase, 'swingweight' should be brought into use by manufacturers as accepted detector terminology and included in their 'specifications' sheet. It could be expressed to describe the 'in-use weight' of a detector at each of the different lower stem length settings.

This would would be helpful to potential buyers and give some indication of weight/balance in operation for the 'taller/shorter' detectorists amongst us. ::g Regards ss47
Arado 130 - Garrett Groundhog - Tesoro Eldorado - Fisher 1265X - Goldmax Power Makro Racer. Homemade Harness!

Filternozzle
Posts: 375
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2013 12:08 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 13 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Filternozzle » Sat May 13, 2017 7:51 am

I would have thought the lighter the coil the better as it is easy enough to balance the detector by adding any necessary weight adjustment in the form of lead to the appropriate point on the detector.
Updated NEXUS MP & Minelab GPX-5000 ::g

chesters4
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:59 pm
Location: Surrey
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by chesters4 » Sun May 14, 2017 11:19 pm

Light as possible for me ,i have a fused vertebrae and its 2 hours max using my f75 nel but 4+ hours using an ultimate coil.
A light coil cannot unbalance a detector as your pivoting at your elbow but a heavy one can make it tip heavy so you need more force upwards to stop the coil stopping when its rubbing the ground.
I had an explorer and my arm was actually sore the next day keeping the coil at the correct hight on rough ground ,an hour and my back was beginning to tell me its time for a rest
The total weight should be used in adverts ,a detector should have its weight with batteries etc and in one advert i spotted the coil excluding the wire and cover was excluded so you needed to add those to get the real weight
My fx1 probe actuaaly makes my machine feel lighter an the probe bit counteracts the weight of the coil ,how people cope with it below the control box seems strange!?

User avatar
liamnolan
Moderator
Posts: 9077
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:06 am
Location: Norwich - originally from Dublin, southern Ireland
Has thanked: 141 times
Been thanked: 153 times
Contact:

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by liamnolan » Mon May 15, 2017 8:34 am

Plus many people allow the cable to end up wrapped around the lower stem and that in itself presents a problem to arm comfort, more weight to stop and then start again on each sweep. It also causes "falsing" on many machines. Having said that, it can be handy in small does to get more weight into a light head to push through stiff stubble! This is a good topic as it allows us to better understand what is happening to the arm when we start swinging, there should be some kind of balance/swing weight rating similar to when you buy a tennis racket, Liam
Deus, WSi's - In the end we will regret the chances we didn't take, the relationships we were afraid to have and the decisions we waited too long to make .. Secretary Irish Metal Detecting Society IMDS

Koala
Posts: 2614
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:47 pm
Location: Cheshire
Has thanked: 63 times
Been thanked: 194 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Koala » Mon May 15, 2017 11:56 am

How you swing makes a big difference both to your arm joints and detector joints.

Full speed left
Stop
Full speed right (worse)

Or

Speed up left then slow down for change of direction
Stop
Speed up right then slow down for change of direction (better)


Or

Constant speed left and right and push the coil more like a figure of eight. (best)

Nexus
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 10:58 pm
Has thanked: 43 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Nexus » Thu May 18, 2017 8:47 am

I suppose everyone have their own view on the search coil weight.
However I would still place my bid on the lowest possible weight no matter the size.
The new Silver Scout concentric coils for MP turned out 365 grams max. for the 11.5" and 300 grams max. for the 9". The weight mentioned is without coil cover.

Now follows the 20"DD with an expected weight of 600 grams max.

User avatar
JBM
Posts: 1912
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:46 am
Location: Bristol
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 57 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by JBM » Thu May 18, 2017 9:19 am

As the user gets older the weight factor comes into play.

Years ago I used to swing a Dustbin lid sized coil on a Minelab.

These days using the Deus with the smaller lightweight coils has paid off.

Incidentally more finds come out now that ever before and I dig less rubbish.

Yes I go more slowly and that improves my finds rate, but certainly the Big coils dont suit all purposes.

Happy Hunting,

Jerry.

User avatar
liamnolan
Moderator
Posts: 9077
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:06 am
Location: Norwich - originally from Dublin, southern Ireland
Has thanked: 141 times
Been thanked: 153 times
Contact:

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by liamnolan » Thu May 18, 2017 6:46 pm

Option 1
Large heavy coil that will detect a tin can at 17 inches b;=+
Option 2
Light coil that will detect same can at 12 inches B-)

Choose Option 1 if you want to find more tin cans, wreck your back and spend most of your detecting time in a hole.
Choose option 2 if you want to move around all day, still find the good targets and feel no arm pain later on in the pub.

People buy heavy big coils right from the start and never get to know how to use a "normal" sized coil. They assume Big is Better but not always, in detecting anyway =)) Liam
Deus, WSi's - In the end we will regret the chances we didn't take, the relationships we were afraid to have and the decisions we waited too long to make .. Secretary Irish Metal Detecting Society IMDS

Nexus
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 10:58 pm
Has thanked: 43 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: The importance of search coil weight?

Post by Nexus » Thu May 18, 2017 7:17 pm

liamnolan wrote:
Thu May 18, 2017 6:46 pm
Option 1
Large heavy coil that will detect a tin can at 17 inches b;=+
Option 2
Light coil that will detect same can at 12 inches B-)

Choose Option 1 if you want to find more tin cans, wreck your back and spend most of your detecting time in a hole.
Choose option 2 if you want to move around all day, still find the good targets and feel no arm pain later on in the pub.

People buy heavy big coils right from the start and never get to know how to use a "normal" sized coil. They assume Big is Better but not always, in detecting anyway =)) Liam
How about a large light coil (instead of big heavy one) used on the right place - one that have a considerable probability to find for example a hoard of coins at 17", or a Roman Sesterci, or a bracelet and so on instead of a tin can? Just wondering!

Post Reply

Return to “NEXUS Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests