Garrett 300i falsing

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mowdie
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Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:08 pm

Good evening all,

Went out on my first club dig yesterday but have been on my own permission a couple of times. Ground yesterday was dry, hard and extremely rocky. Started off in all metal but notched out anything under 40. First signal was clean and read 71 both ways. Dug the target and got a rusted coach bolt. Second signal was clean and around 82. Dug the signal and found a 6 inch rusted nail. Third signal was a scratchy 50 but dug it and got a rusted bent nail. Switched to coin mode and first signal came upon at around 76, signal was clear high tone in the detector so dug the target. A substantial piece of iron possibly cast around 6 inches down. Several signals throughout the day and all were dug. Got an assortment of iron and all rusty. Almost every other person on the dig got roman coin or coins. I think final tally for silver was two. I'm not really surprised other people got coins as I had apparently cleared out all the iron on the site. All signals apart from one were clear and in the mid to high tone. No grunts were dug. All targets showed ID's from 50 to 92. Any advice would be welcome from a 300i user.

Kindest regards
Mowdie



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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Mud Max » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:58 pm

I had a 400i, here are my thoughts. Notching out four bars is a lot of discrimination for a Roman site. Romans give low conductivity, often the same numbers or tones that you get with scrap, I don't mean pure iron signals here but they are often iffy. Four bars may be too harsh to get a signal on the Romans. Your machine could be cutting them out because they are not pure enough on a strong level of discrimination. Try relics.

Also you are running at 8khz. 8khz is a mid range all rounder, generally speaking frequencies of 15-20khz are considered better for those skinny little Roman coins, they are tricky at the best of times, so this may make a slight difference.

Are you using the standard coil? If so, an upgrade could help, something like a Nel Hunter.

Big iron can fool the aces, from the description of the pieces it sounds like you were a bit unlucky to go over quite a few lumps.
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mowdie
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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:56 pm

Hi Mud Max, thanks for the advice. A couple of the guys yesterday were doubtful of the signals I was getting until they tried it for themselves with tests on Romans and on my scrap metal. I will try it on relic next time out without disc. Worst comes to the worst, I got nearly a ton of iron to take to the scrappies.

Kindest regards
Mowdie

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Easylife » Mon Jun 11, 2018 11:14 pm

mowdie wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:56 pm
Worst comes to the worst, I got nearly a ton of iron to take to the scrappies.
8khz should be quite good to identify iron, larger bits can give a good tone on most detectors, though it is usually the iron washers and buckles. I'm not familiar with the 300i but think you just had a particularly unlucky day. You could test it on some small coins to reassure yourself. ::g
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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:31 am

Hi Easylife,

I have done fairly extensive air tests and have buried all sorts in a clean bit of the garden so I could practice with the machine. I wrote a chart of what metals give what signals at different depths and still, I only get iron. I will bury the pieces I got on Sunday alongside some gold, silver, coins and etc and start over. I was listening for variations in tones on Sunday and dug mostly the clean clear high tones and mid tones and also dug a couple of the scratchy mid tone ones, perhaps I should have dug the grunts as well. I also had a similar problem to Kernowviking in an earlier post where I got a good signal and dug the target but there was nothing to find. Signal was there, then it wasn't. I guess I will just have to persevere and learn more about the detector. I think I might take Mud Max's advice and go for a different coil as well. Unsure whether to go small to get in between iron or go bigger to get deeper targets. I think at the moment if I go deeper I will just be digging older Iron.

I suppose I could do the same as most other newbies and blame the machine and go out and buy a Nox or a Deus. Or I could sell my machine and move on to an easier hobby like hang gliding or extreme ironing.

Thanks for your response to my post. Hopefully I will eventually be posting interesting finds instead of the junk I'm currenty digging.

Kindest regards

Mowdie

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Resurgam » Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:59 am

mowdie wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:31 am
Hi Easylife,

I also had a similar problem to Kernowviking in an earlier post where I got a good signal and dug the target but there was nothing to find. Signal was there, then it wasn't.

Thanks for your response to my post. Hopefully I will eventually be posting interesting finds instead of the junk I'm currenty digging.

Kindest regards

Mowdie
Reading the above statement brought back memories of almost missing a Queen Elizabeth I hammered silver sixpence. I was out with the North Wales Dirt Diggers and we were working a welsh hillside when my then Garrett EuroAce gave me a nice top end bell note and I dug in, only to have the signal disappear.

A quick probing of the hole with the Garrett ProPinter proved that the target was still in the hole and I quickly spaded out a little more soil. The ProPointer then indicated that the target was possibly out of the hole but neither the detector nor the ProPointed could detect the target, that was now 'probably' in the spoil heap. :-SS

Further scanning of the spoil heap with bothe the detector and the ProPointer had the target disappearing and reappearing several times and I was close to throwing in the towel, back filling the hole, and moving on. On my knees and detector laid to one side I then continued to chase the elusive signal, hand full of soil by hand full of soil. Determination eventually brought to light a Lizzy silver sixpence but it took me a little while, and some secondary advice, to determine what
I had actually found.

That day taught me a very valuable lesson and I tend to be much more determined to investigate what may appear to have been a ghost signal.

Good luck and happy hunting

Chris ::g
Garrett ProPointer + MineLab Safari + Quest Q40, and loads of determination.

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Tue Jun 12, 2018 12:51 pm

Hi Resurgam,
tried all the above but could not find or get a signal on the missing articles once they were dug. Ground was tussocky so I went slower than usual and swept over and around signals to confirm a target. Plug was cut and loose earth was placed onto a plastic sheet. Try as I might the two signals that were lost could not be found under any circumstance. Short of riddling the earth, I tried everything, even changed the battery in my pinpointer as I began to doubt that. Both good signals in the mid seventies with clear top tones, then nothing. I'm thinking of selling my detector and buying a fishing magnet, It'll probably pick up less iron than I got on Sunday. On the flip side, it was a beautiful day and it was an absolute pleasure being out in the countryside.

Thanks for your response.

Kindest regards

mowdie

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Dave The Slave » Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:43 pm

Hello Mowdie,
Have been using the 400i for over 18 months, basically the same machine just a slightly larger coil.
Looking at the coin mode, you are using, the last 5 blocks=60 to 99 on the id scale and 25 to 45.
I have always used custom mode as this does fine for me inland or on dry sand.
My custom setting is the last 5 blocks 60 to 99, 2 bars off max sensitivity, sometimes 3 blocks off if falsing due to wet grass and iron audio off.
These settings have found me most of the metals, Silver Denarius, silver milled which was very thin, brass, copper, lead, aluminium, pewter plus all the modern coins. Will also get large deep bits of iron, interesting bits tend to come in between lower 60`s and around 91.
Give Custom a try but add an extra bar, so that you are running 45 to 99 and also increase sensitivity to 2 bars off max.
Don`t forget items have to be there in the first place to even give you a chance of finding them. It was only on my 8th outing after around 18 hrs that I found my first coin , inland with the 400i.
Hope this may be of use to you .
Good Luck ::g
Dave.
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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:21 pm

Hi fatherland,

Thanks for that. I will give these settings a try on my next outing. I was already running the machine on sensitivity two from max and had notched out first 4 bars, so not too far distant from your custom mode. Weird thing was I was hitting iron at 50, 71, 72, 82, 84 and 91. All of the signals were good but all came out as iron in a range of sizes from pieces of square cut nails to a lump of iron 3x2 inches that looks as if it came off a leaf spring. Everyone else dug roman coins, a couple found silver hammies and two found roman bronze partefacts. I know it's down to me that I'm finding scrap as the machine is definitely finding stuff. I just need to learn to read the tones and Id's a bit better.

Thanks for your response
Kindest regards

Mowdie

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:24 pm

Sorry guys fatherland should read davetheslave. I'm on a kindle and it kindly changes everything to whatever it thinks is right. Grrrrrrr.

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Mowdiel

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by SuperRed » Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:07 pm

mowdie wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:24 pm
Sorry guys fatherland should read davetheslave. I'm on a kindle and it kindly changes everything to whatever it thinks is right. Grrrrrrr.

Kindest regards
Mowdiel
Lol :D I know that one!
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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Toolz » Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:41 pm

mowdie wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:21 pm
Hi fatherland,

Thanks for that. I will give these settings a try on my next outing. I was already running the machine on sensitivity two from max and had notched out first 4 bars, so not too far distant from your custom mode. Weird thing was I was hitting iron at 50, 71, 72, 82, 84 and 91. All of the signals were good but all came out as iron in a range of sizes from pieces of square cut nails to a lump of iron 3x2 inches that looks as if it came off a leaf spring. Everyone else dug roman coins, a couple found silver hammies and two found roman bronze partefacts. I know it's down to me that I'm finding scrap as the machine is definitely finding stuff. I just need to learn to read the tones and Id's a bit better.

Thanks for your response
Kindest regards

Mowdie
How are you getting on any better?
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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by mowdie » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:25 pm

Hi toolz,

Sorry i didn't get back to you sooner but I'm not detecting at the moment. I am studying hard for my nidan grading in March so it takes up alll of my spare time. I will get out detecting in the spring though. I miss getting out into the fresh air.

Kindest regards

Mowdie

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by detecting rod » Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:44 am

when numbers are pinging all over the place going up and down would you try to locate best number or ignore as rubbish,ive also not been digging things under 60 unless a real ping ,am i missing out on alot by having first 4 bars off and only digging 60 plus readings,as ive also read some gold items show up as 27-42?

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by amphora » Mon Jul 29, 2019 12:31 pm

I dig low numbers. I always say: Dig more, find more. ;)

detecting rod wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:44 am
when numbers are pinging all over the place going up and down would you try to locate best number or ignore as rubbish

I especially dig those if at least one beep among them is above iron. Many real treasures were between the lot's of rubbish. Or under that rubbish.
Keep ignoring them. ::g Then i will dig those. :D
Good luck hunting.
Disclaimer: If i give advices i talk from my personal perspective, and it is not to copy 1 on 1. I rely on everyone’s common sense. Everyone has to think himself about implementing it for himself and to consider legal circumstances.

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by detecting rod » Mon Jul 29, 2019 1:44 pm

thx being its a common land lots of can rings bottle tops ect ,thats why im not hitting lower numbers a few years down the line when ive finished it all and the woods behind it ,il go over again and just hit all numbers ,but good to know about digging multiple pings as good hidden in with scrap

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by 4Tuna » Mon Jul 29, 2019 8:08 pm

mowdie wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:08 pm

Started off in all metal but notched out anything under 40. First signal was clean and read 71 both ways. Dug the target and got a rusted coach bolt. Second signal was clean and around 82. Dug the signal and found a 6 inch rusted nail. Third signal was a scratchy 50 but dug it and got a rusted bent nail. Switched to coin mode and first signal came upon at around 76, signal was clear high tone in the detector so dug the target. A substantial piece of iron possibly cast around 6 inches down. Several signals throughout the day and all were dug. Got an assortment of iron and all rusty. Almost every other person on the dig got roman coin or coins. I think final tally for silver was two. I'm not really surprised other people got coins as I had apparently cleared out all the iron on the site. All signals apart from one were clear and in the mid to high tone. No grunts were dug. All targets showed ID's from 50 to 92. Any advice would be welcome from a 300i user.

Kindest regards
Mowdie

This is not falsing as you say. This is the machine telling you that there is metal in the ground.

Beware the 'numbers'..

The machine is trying to convert the signal it receives, into a number.

Take into account that not only the conductivity of the target (if it is coin sized/shaped the number will be accurate) but the SIZE & SHAPE of the object. So is mashing together 2/3 potentially conflicting bits of information into a simple to understand number, on the read out.

This is why you are getting mixed messages. Larger items will result in a larger number, almost irrespective of the material it is made up. And 'odd' shaped targets will get the readout jumping.

Bear in mind these machines are designed for 'coin shooting' (for want of a better phrase) They will give you an accurate conductivity reading, numeric & depth reading - IF the target is a coin.

They are American designed, with the American market in mind.

With this information on board, I struggle to see the purpose of discriminating anything above 40.

This video from Garrett is an example of why this is, at best not wise, at worst you are choosing to discriminate GOLD. as in GOLD.



Not only people doing it themselves, but recommending their 'settings' to others, not content with potentially missing the the good stuff themselves..

(No names mentioned - Dave)

There are some pinpointing tips, for working out if the '86' number the machine is showing is a MASSIVE iron or a coin sized coin, from a similar thread below.

But by the sounds of it, you had an unlucky day.

If this hobby does nothing else, it teaches you patience..

BTW a 1910 Silver Half Crown is a solid '99' on the scale, before you believe any Voodoo of 'I don't dig this/that number ;)


4Tuna wrote:
Thu Jul 04, 2019 6:56 pm
detecting rod wrote:
Thu Jul 04, 2019 9:56 am
ok my garret 300i is just over a week old been playing with it in garden,watching and reading lots of things ,but ive set it to jewellery mode getting strong high pitched sounds scores 85-99 but still seems to be mainly iron,have found 1 coin a 1962 sixpence ,but im still ruining the lawn digging mainly iron?also as new to the hobbbie every thing looks exciting at minute so even though lots of iron couple of bits i would like to have a better look at whats best way to do this ,clean off alot of rust i mean ?
Ah, the both incredible & horrendous feeling of having a detector & no where to explore! Vivid memories..

So before you totally destroy your lawn..

Jewelry mode is a good starting point.

If you are having iron issues, knock off another bar of discrimination in custom mode. Leaving you with an audio alert, of all signals above 40.

Large signals in the 80/90 range can be identified before digging, by getting to know the pinpoint function.

A coin type item will most likely give a similar number in the 80/90 range, but once you have scanned over the area using the pinpoint, you will be able tell the rough size of the target.

Try with a visual, above ground test to begin with - place a coin on the floor & use the pinpoint.

Then a large piece of iron (sounds like you have dug some ready to test!)

The signal of a large object will begin to show far away (compared to the small)

A coin type target will go from silent, to loud very quickly. While a MASSIVE IRON will register from quite a distance & the sound will increase in intensity, the closer you get, over a longer space. Indicating something bigger.

This works vertically as well as on a sweep type motion.

Try it. Hold the coil above the coin with the pinpoint active & lift it straight up.

The sound dies off quickly.

Again, hold the coil above the MASSIVE IRON with the pinpoint active, & lift straight up. You may be able to register a signal/sound some 10/20/30cm ABOVE the item.

Indicating that it is indeed, not a lovely coin, but just a chunk of MASSIVE IRON.

Image

And look up electrolysis for cleaning up rusted finds..

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Jamesey1981 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 10:01 pm

After you have dug up your rusty nail are you checking the hole with the Garrett or just having a little root around with the pinpointer?

I ask as quite a few times I have dug up a bit of scrap while following the pinpointer but when I go over it again the original target is still there, I have a 300i, sometimes that original target is a pull tab or other rubbish, sometimes it's a coin.

I notch out only the lowest few bars on the discrimination, and if i can get a stable target I dig it, sometimes I also dig it if it's a bit scruffy and I'm not sure about it, I'd rather dig an extra hole than miss something good. The target ID is only telling you the conductivity of the target and is never going to be 100% accurate, I have dug up coins that registered in the 30s.

The information about the pinpoint function in the post above is really useful as well, it does help a lot when deciding if you have a crowbar or a coin.

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by 4Tuna » Mon Jul 29, 2019 10:43 pm

Jamesey1981 wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 10:01 pm

The target ID is only telling you the conductivity of the target and is never going to be 100% accurate, I have dug up coins that registered in the 30s.

Almost.

The target ID is telling you a combination of the conductivity of the the target, together with its size..

For example, silver.

Image

Both coins are silver (similar conductivity)

Both coins are a different size.

The Half crown hits a magnificent '99' while the wee hammered farthing reads a paltry '64'

The number is generated from a combination of readings from the machine, so can't be taken as a simple outcome..

Capeesh.

Out of interest, which coins showed in the 30's?

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Re: Garrett 300i falsing

Post by Jamesey1981 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 10:56 pm

Fair enough, I just know it doesnt always make sense! Good info though, makes a bit more sense, I like half crowns too, they're pleasantly chunky.

Modern pennies so nothing exciting, pretty deep on a beach, they normally come up towards the top end but a couple of times I have had them in the 30s. Was surprised when they came up, my machine doesnt like the beach much though so that might be why.

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