How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

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Guppy
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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Guppy » Wed May 22, 2019 7:06 pm

Mancave-man wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 1:01 pm
So, lets get this right. If I were to reduce my Iron bias to "1" or "0" and my recovery speed to say "3" would that be a better set up than the killer programme that I currently use?
I am something of a timid fiddler so tend to let other's programmes guide my thinking. However in this case I'm wondering if I am actually causing myself problems by clouding my judgement?
I have reduced my Iron Bias to "3" on my last couple of digs but I haven't really noticed any difference in the performance of the machine. Mind you it is very dry up here at the moment making digging very difficult. So that might be one of the problems.
I would be very interested in knowing your pasture and ploughed/rolled settings though. :-/
Best regards to all,

M-m [:)


You may find the below guide jargon free and informative.....

http://thesilverfiend.com/minelab-equin ... explained/



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Easylife
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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Easylife » Wed May 22, 2019 10:48 pm

Guppy wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 7:06 pm
You may find the below guide jargon free and informative.....

http://thesilverfiend.com/minelab-equin ... explained/
That's a good explanation of Iron bias. I use Iron bias 0 on my pasture sites as I don't wish to make any non-ferrous targets sound like iron. :D s;..
Nox 800, 15" coil & Garrett carrot.
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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Easylife » Thu May 23, 2019 2:03 am

littleboot wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:25 pm
Its all really very simple in one way. The art is, as ever, the judgement call in what you do and don't dig. And of course you have to set up your machine in a way that appeals to you and you get satisfaction and enjoyment using.
Well I think you summed it up there perfectly Jan as most 'special' programs are just really only minor tweaks of basic programs and hardly game changers especially with the newer detectors.
I guess that many don't experiment with settings and just eternally seek a magic program that will find them 'treasure'? :))
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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Saffron » Thu May 23, 2019 2:25 am

littleboot wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:25 pm
Thing is, its pointless using someone elses settings and expecting them to be a perfect fit if your land is different to theirs.
TenPence says it all really...but to clarify:
If you get to know your machine, the sounds it makes, the way it behaves in various conditions from clean pasture to iron infested arable etc AND learn what the various settings do, what the pay-off is of increasing or decreasing a value and what is cost, how each control works with the others....then the actual settings you use come in with the tide.
I don't really think about settings in terms of trying out a 'killer' that or ''ultimate' the other. What the hell does THAT mean? I simply start with an average or a pre-set and then if the ground tells me to I can increase or decrease sensitivity, I can speed up or slow down recovery, and whatever else the field conditions call for. Too chirpy? lower sensitivity a tad. A lot of close mixed targets? Increase recovery and make sure I go slow. Clean ground? I can set it up to deliver depth. Iron Bias is a depth killer and needs to be as low as you can cope with/ still enjoy using.
That's it. Its all really very simple in one way. The art is, as ever, the judgement call in what you do and don't dig. And of course you have to set up your machine in a way that appeals to you and you get satisfaction and enjoyment using.
Very well said, and reflects what I have just posted about Recovery Speed.

I am sure if EVERYBODY was forced to read this and follow the common sense in it that the vast bulk of detectorists would find an increase in thier finds rate.

"Killer" or "Ultimate" programs are what works for ONE person in ONE set of conditions.

A few days ago I saw the settings that an American visitor to the UK was using as he was wanting to find Saxon gold (don't we all!?), but due to his limited time here speed was esential so he set the machine up for a fast swing speed and detecting fairly shallow targets ... due to the time limit there was a logic to this. BUT if he tried that on my well detected ground where depth is the important factor his finds would be VERY limited.

Evan

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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Easylife » Thu May 23, 2019 4:09 am

Saffron wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:25 am

A few days ago I saw the settings that an American visitor to the UK was using as he was wanting to find Saxon gold (don't we all!?), but due to his limited time here speed was esential so he set the machine up for a fast swing speed and detecting fairly shallow targets ... due to the time limit there was a logic to this. BUT if he tried that on my well detected ground where depth is the important factor his finds would be VERY limited.
I could never imagine any old finds being shallow on my pasture ground, but on cultivated anything is possible. ::g Still, it's nice and flat and I like it. :))
Nox 800, 15" coil & Garrett carrot.
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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by mitch » Thu May 23, 2019 12:24 pm

Ok, so here's another newbie to the nox 600. Apologise in advance for the semmingly repeated but necessary advice on the nox settings.
I am very new to this machine, only had it a week, been out with it, but to be perfectly honest hadn't a clue what I was doing or finding. I use it at the moment on a basic setting of Field 1, no adjustments.
My question is, I was thinking of using this setting while learning, but, also creating a couple of user profiles with different settings ie: one with higher iron bias and lower recovery speed, and maybe one with a 10kh frequency for checking iron. This way I could quickly and simply switch between profiles to learn and hear the differences without getting caught up with all the fiddling. Would this be a good way forward?
Many thanks.
'where's the rich stuff Mikey?'

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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by littleboot » Thu May 23, 2019 12:53 pm

I really don't see the need for this at present mitch. You say you don't really understand the machine yet and haven't a clue what you and it are doing just yet. How can changing settings and setting up user profiles help this?
Far too early for that. Use Field 1 until you DO know what you are doing. Keep using it until you are confident and THEN see about some changes. The phrase trying to run before you can walk springs to mind.
Once you get to grips with the machine properly it will become clear what, if anything, could be tweaked on certain permissions. I have never really understood the fuss about saved programs. The Nox is a doddle to change the settings on...takes me a couple of minutes from start to finish. Don't see why saving settings is such a biggie. It isn't necessary you know. Somethings save anyway. Just chill and enjoy using your Nox.
Equinox 600, GMP, wellies.

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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Blackadder43 » Thu May 23, 2019 1:03 pm

mitch wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 12:24 pm
This way I could quickly and simply switch between profiles to learn and hear the differences without getting caught up with all the fiddling. Would this be a good way forward?
Many thanks.
Hi Mitch
One suggestion that might help you, wont cost you very much, can be set up and done in less than a day, and for the most part can be left in situ for future experiments
It does rely on the fact that you will need a permission to do this

You need to set yourself up a test garden, on your permission
Either a permenant one or a temporary one, your choice

Find yourself a rusty old nail, a ring pull, some silver foil, pre decimal coinage, modern if you wish, a few roman grots and the all importnant Hammered coin
All of these can be purchased for pennys from the online auction site that we shall not mention on our forums

Now a basic test bed would be dig holes to a depth you are happy with and place objects in and fil holes and stamp back down
You really should log all the details on your pc or a scrap of paper or whatever
Then, approach each target in your standard settings, then tweak each settings and log the differences it makes
Because you already know what the object is and how deep it is, this will allow you to learn what tweaks are doing what to your machine, on finds that you know are there
You spend half a day doing this and you will soon become one with your machine

Some of the tweaks and conversations that are around on the net are sometimes so complicated that its nuances will not resonate with you, because they are how someone else sets up and uses their machine
The Nox is a great machine, i keep saying this but i came from an Etrac and the transition took one morning
I am not saying i know my machine inside out, because i dont (lack of me going out may be the cause of that)
But i do spend a lot of time experimenting with settings on the fly, and then i dig the target and log in my mind what i did and how it changed the responses
Good luck fella
::g
When you are right no one remembers; when you are wrong no one forgets

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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by mitch » Thu May 23, 2019 1:08 pm

Thanks Blackadder, I have numerous permissions thankfully, so will try this also, I would do it in my garden as it is large, however it is full to the rim with crap and trash, if I experimented on my garden it would end up looking like Oak Island lol.
Many thanks.
'where's the rich stuff Mikey?'

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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Sportsman » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:43 pm

Had the nox 12 months now and one thing it doesn't handle very well is iron its a shame iron and the vdi let it down imo , 50 tones is the best of the lot of tones imo if you want to avoid digging loads of iron ::g
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Re: How to Stop digging Iron - for beginners

Post by Bors » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:11 pm

I use All metal with my settings all the time and I find next to no Iron . I won`t lie or be so bold as to say NO iron because as we know certain shaped Iron will give a positive signal and convince you its good but saying that ,very little does fool me and I don`t often go down to 0 on my IB. I find after from when I first got the Nox after following Freds advice on the settings initially ,then a tweak here ,and a tweak there as & when I feel its necessary works for me , I don`t feel I`m missing much in the way of finds and I don`t dig hardly any Iron so my set up suits me and I feel is adequate for the job.
I`m not by any means knocking ten pences settings as I`m sure they work just as well for him and anyone else who uses similar settings, but I find if you find something that works well for YOU ,stick with it .

If it aint broke why try to fix it. ::g
Last edited by Bors on Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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