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ID Challenge No 2 (02 - 05/07/18)

Past ID Challenges can be found in this forum.
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thefiggis
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ID Challenge No 2 (02 - 05/07/18)

Post by thefiggis »

What ho, and sorry for the delay in getting this second challenge out. The system threw a wobbler on the first one and sent out email notifications to everybody whenever a reply was made. Said system has since been thrashed with a knobbly stick so all should now be fine. Any road up, on with the motley...

This is an occasional series of threads designed to get an ID on an item, but with a difference. Here, you will have the opportunity to offer your opinion but you won't be influenced by other views as you won't be able to see them. The thread will be locked and you will have three days to submit your ID by using the ID Challenge form (link below). At the end of the allotted time the responses will be collated and put into a now re-opened thread for discussion.

The reason for the challenge format is to give everybody a chance to do their own research and come up with an idea without outside influence, the need to get in first, or indeed feeling that there's no need to offer an ID because someone else has already done it. Everyone is on an equal footing.

While we do of course learn from other people (and long may that continue) and the ID section will continue to run as normal,there's nothing like your own research to give a better, fuller understanding and this series should help us all with that.

So, we hope you'll enjoy the ID Challenge and that you get a lot out of it.

Challenge No.2
Start: Monday 02-07-18
Thread opens for discussion: after 5.00pm on Thursday 05-07-18

The object is copper alloy and measures 24mm long and 11mm wide. The reverse side is blank.

In the challenge series most items submitted will be unidentified at the start but some will be known. This one is known and its purpose will be revealed at the end of any discussion when the thread is opened up.

Have fun ::g
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Essential equipment:
Some sort of electrical gubbins(I'm told it's a Deus). In various colours
Jenkins
Gin.

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Post by Allectus »

Medieval strap end from a book-clasp.
Only in it for the ££££'s =P~

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Post by Junior »

Saxon , part of a cloths hook, the bit the hook hooks onto ....

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Post by hd1958 »

some sort of strapend

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Post by Spearhead »

10th century Zoomorphic strap fitting.

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Post by Stillburning »

Medieval book clasp.
I'm still burning you'll never put the spark out in my soul

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Post by Easylife »

A book fitting.
Nox 800, 15" coil & Garrett carrot.
White's TDI SL

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Bradrick
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Post by Bradrick »

Medieval clothes fastener?
Equinox 800
XP Deus
C-Scope 1220b

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Life is difficult. Once we truly know that life is difficult and we truly understand and accept it, then life is no longer difficult.

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Post by stanslad »

Medieval book clasp piece

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Post by beaubrummell »

Sword belt hanger? Saxon maybe.
Teknetics T2 SE DST
Detech Ultimate
Whites TRX pointer
Lesche Digging Tool
AMES entrenching tool
Souped-up Spear & Jackson mini spade
Garrett MS-3 Z-Lynk wireless headphones
Tomcat Dakota boots
NCMD membership number 13566

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Post by Bootneck45RM »

Are you being sneaky and showing it upside down - could it be a swinging pull handle of some sort?
Go not quietly into the dark night - take a torch and a trumpet! - and cause a rucus!

Swany

Post by Swany »

A user, Swany, has applied with an Answer for the ID Challenge.
Real name: Swany

A medieval book clasp.

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Post by Saki »

A user, Saki, has applied with an Answer for the ID Challenge.
Real name: Saki

Late 16th, or very early 17th century Candle ejector
Equinox 600.
Ace400i with Nel Thunder
Garrett Carrot
CScope CS2M
Bags of patience and a need for research x;

"A little inaccuracy sometimes saves tons of explanation." Saki

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Post by Bootneck45RM »

Book clasp ??
Go not quietly into the dark night - take a torch and a trumpet! - and cause a rucus!

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Post by Bootneck45RM »

Early clothes fastener.
Go not quietly into the dark night - take a torch and a trumpet! - and cause a rucus!

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Post by oldartefact »

Female side of a dress fastening.
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Post by Spooky »

Medieval Dress Hook
Quid adfers? LXXXIII viverra anulum tizer !

Nox 800

CMD Carbon Fibre stem

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Post by shaggybfc »

Broken part of a Roman book clasp.
XP Deus, 11" X35 coil, WS4 back-phones, remote and an empty bank balance. XP MI 6 pin pointer. Garrett Ace 250 wireless MPow set up.
They told me I’d never be any good at poetry, because I’m dyslexic, but so far I’ve made 3 jugs and a vase.

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Post by saxman »

Post medieval clothes fastening.....not sure what else to say really
Deus large and small coil, shovel and stuff!

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Post by Lolly »

A key of some type maybe
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Post by CTX_Phil »

I would say a ***** medieval book fitting....judging by the clean, rich patina I would say it was found in ******, Suffolk ;)

Certain details edited out cos of Phil's remarkable detective skills which would scuttle the discussion which will hopefully follow. I am in awe, O Master :D ::g

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Post by thefiggis »

Thanks, everyone, for all your responses and hopefully you got something out of any research ::g

The resourcefulness of some people never fails to amaze me and a couple of you (you know who you are ;) ) showed just how deep they can delve and should get jobs with a private detective agency. :E

Any road up, there appear to be two main camps on this one - the book claspers and the dress hookers (both of which descriptions sound vaguely indecent) - and it might be interesting to hear how you arrived at your answers. What were the features of the item which caused you to go the way you did? What pointers did you follow?

Thanks again for a great response and hopefully an enlightening discussion will follow, at the end of which I'll post up what it is and why I selected it for this challenge.

::g

Oh, one last thing... if anyone gets an email notification whenever a reply is made to this thread please let me know. This was an issue on the last challenge but which has now hopefully been seen off.
Essential equipment:
Some sort of electrical gubbins(I'm told it's a Deus). In various colours
Jenkins
Gin.

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Post by CTX_Phil »

Lol I was looking at my edited post above with the added stars thinking I don't recall swearing x;

I imagine the rectangular loop on one end would have made some think it was a dress fastener but the opposite end definitely suggests something different 👍

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Post by Junior »

I'm I going blind.....can't see what it woz ???? x; thanks.....sorry jumping the gun a bit....where's my prize.....an equionox would b good ( prob wrong like last time it'll b a book clasp thingies thing)

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Post by thefiggis »

Patience, grasshopper...
Essential equipment:
Some sort of electrical gubbins(I'm told it's a Deus). In various colours
Jenkins
Gin.

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Post by fred »

Look in the PAS Finds Recording Guides and all will be revealed! :D

There are guides out for most classes of small metal objects. They are incredibly detailed and, unlike the database itself sometimes, pretty consistently reliable! ::g
Last edited by fred on Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Well worn Equinox 800 x2
Nice (temporarily) shiny new one x1

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Post by Junior »

fred wrote:
Thu Jul 05, 2018 6:59 pm
Look in the PAS guides and all will be revealed! :D
Toooooo hot for tooooo much finggggggger movement 8-}

Fred ......how come only 1 explorer..... :D

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Post by thefiggis »

As already said, the ID of the item falls largely within two groups and this is hardly surprising since the FLO did this all by his very own self when he IDed it as a clothes fastener from the pics I sent him but changed it to medieval book clasp when I handed it over. The PAS description reads:
An incomplete cast copper-alloy book fitting dating to the Medieval period, c. 1350-1450. Originally the fitting consisted of a separate fitting and plate, though now only the former survives intact. The object consists a rectangular projecting loop at the back edge of the object (effectively creating a strap-bar) which transitions into a circular body with a circular aperture at its centre (through which a stud attached to the book itself would have fitted) and incised decoration on its upper surface. Extending from the front edge of the mid-section is a zoomorphic terminal with a second circular aperture through its 'mouth', angled at right-angles to the main orientation of the fitting itself.
The fact that the FLO misidentified it from photos highlights the fact that sometimes you really need to have an object in your hand to get the true picture and that small details can alter that picture. (Search for Read type E fastener and see how similar it is.)

It goes to illustrate that here on the forum we only have images to go by, so the request to include as much information as you can with your ID request is an important one, especially when it comes to artefacts. It's also testimony to the incredible knowledge base on here that thousands of successful IDs have been made by the images alone. Spend a little time and effort in constructing your ID request and those who are willing to help will have a far better chance of giving you an accurate ID. Remember - they'll rarely if ever have the chance to physically examine it.

So, thanks to all who took part and we'll have a new challenge for you soon.

::g
Essential equipment:
Some sort of electrical gubbins(I'm told it's a Deus). In various colours
Jenkins
Gin.

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Post by Junior »

Dooooooooo.wrong again.......2 out of 2 ::g

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Post by Oxgirl36 »

Junior wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:20 pm
Dooooooooo.wrong again.......2 out of 2 ::g
But you tried. In my book that’s a brilliant thumbs up ::g
Carpe vinum

XP Deus !!£$ I use the HOT programme on 17khz, reactivity at 2.5 on v5.21 with the X35 11” coil

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