Have you been priced out.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Fisher1266X »

I have complete empathy for everyone affected by the content of this post.

Unfortunately, most aspects of life have some kind of financial outlook.
As mentioned, if you have the balls to influence a landowner into setting up a rally, then so be it.
After that, it is up to the individual whether or not to pay for access to that land.

I realised in 2011 that rallies for me wasn't the way forward .......on several levels.
That's the reason for a focused view on gaining personal permissions.

If you don't have your own personal permissions, then the next hurdle is how much are you willing to pay for a permission through a rally etc?
Yes, we all agree that people are getting ripped off... but are they in reality?... As they know exactly how much they are going to spend in fuel, fees and food etc.

In a way it's just like angling, you either pay £10 per session because there are lots of 10lb+ carp in the lake or you accept paying a fiver for lots of silvers with a "chance" of a 10lb+ carp/fish?

It's the same for everything, you either spend £100 on a car or £232,000 on one, the choice is yours entirely.

The landowners we are involved with are not interested in rallies ....or "making money" from detecting.

In a way.... it's a case of ......"you get what you pay for".... but unfortunately, you don't get what you "expect" what you're paying for!


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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by liamnolan »

Quote " .. usual drongos" =))
Many years since I saw that phrase, very common when I was in the RAF a million years ago in Lincoln, like "gash" to mean spare/free :D Good memories, Liam :;@
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by fred »

I organise club digs and find that some farmers prefer a steady trickle of income from friendly, low key Sunday digs rather than the disruption of the big money events. :D
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by f8met »

There lies the problem though. Paying more doesn't guarantee finding anything. Spending £25 does not get you a hammered coin unless there are unscrupulous organisers who seed fields with a few cheap coins from ebay (which has been known).
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by chip »

Well today has been a tale of two digs. I went to dig A this morning and the fields were deadly quiet which was a plus I suppose as I hate fields full of modern rubbish. I dug two pot mends, two buttons and a musket ball by lunch, but just was not feeling the love for the place. So after lunch I was seriously thinking about calling it a day.

Then I remembered there was another dig being held literraly a few minutes away. I had already spent £25 getting into dig A but thought I could try my luck at dig B or go home. Dig B I am a regular at and would have infact ended up there if I hadn’t already committed to A before B advertised there dig. B normally costs £15 members £20 non members. I am not a member and only had £15 on me, therein lies the problem.

But I thought I am a regular, it’s gone 1 o’clock surely they will grant me a cheeky half day discount and accept £15 for the last few hours. “No mate was the answer, I explained I only had £15, again “no mate”, I was a bit disappointed as I said I am a regular on their digs, And even on first name terms with Rolo their dog, trouble was it was not Rolos decision to make. So it was home for an early bath :D

At least I found my first musket ball a dig A which sits perfectly on my first whorl I found last week at B’s dig.

::g
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by JBM »

Hi Chip, there`s an old saying from the distant past. "There`s No Sentiment in Business" :( Jerry.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by oldartefact »

chip wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 3:33 pm
Well today has been a tale of two digs. I went to dig A this morning and the fields were deadly quiet which was a plus I suppose as I hate fields full of modern rubbish. I dug two pot mends, two buttons and a musket ball by lunch, but just was not feeling the love for the place. So after lunch I was seriously thinking about calling it a day.

Then I remembered there was another dig being held literraly a few minutes away. I had already spent £25 getting into dig A but thought I could try my luck at dig B or go home. Dig B I am a regular at and would have infact ended up there if I hadn’t already committed to A before B advertised there dig. B normally costs £15 members £20 non members. I am not a member and only had £15 on me, therein lies the problem.

But I thought I am a regular, it’s gone 1 o’clock surely they will grant me a cheeky half day discount and accept £15 for the last few hours. “No mate was the answer, I explained I only had £15, again “no mate”, I was a bit disappointed as I said I am a regular on their digs, And even on first name terms with Rolo their dog, trouble was it was not Rolos decision to make. So it was home for an early bath :D

At least I found my first musket ball a dig A which sits perfectly on my first whorl I found last week at B’s dig.

::g
Sounds like you were dug out, priced out, and then "thrown out"!!! ;;z ;;z ;;z
The outfits that I know operate to very strict rule sets, and if they bend rules for one person then where does it stop?
Turning up half way through the day is not always welcomed by some organisers, since they may perceive that they are second best, if you get my drift. No doubt the organiser felt doubly "hurt" given that you are a regular. That is the way of detecting I'm afraid.
Many thanks for posting a very entertaining summary of your day, and I hope that your next outing fares much better ::g ::g ::g OooO .
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by chip »

I have dig C tomorrow, this detecting is like a disease. I did stop off at a farm near me on the way home today. Turns out it’s owned by the local water board, sent them an email but not holding my breath.
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Phil2401 »

chip wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 5:07 pm
I have dig C tomorrow, this detecting is like a disease. I did stop off at a farm near me on the way home today. Turns out it’s owned by the local water board, sent them an email but not holding my breath.
Opportunity here - tell the Water Board you're also a dowser - (and learn quickly how to dowse) - they might be grateful at the moment... just a thought ;)

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Koala »

L
chip wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 3:33 pm
Well today has been a tale of two digs. I went to dig A this morning and the fields were deadly quiet which was a plus I suppose as I hate fields full of modern rubbish. I dug two pot mends, two buttons and a musket ball by lunch, but just was not feeling the love for the place. So after lunch I was seriously thinking about calling it a day.
So often. By midday the rally car park is half empty.

The last swing of the day is as likely to produce a nice find as the first. The more hours the coil is to the soil, the greater the odds are you will find something nice.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by chip »

Koala wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 5:29 pm
L
chip wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 3:33 pm
Well today has been a tale of two digs. I went to dig A this morning and the fields were deadly quiet which was a plus I suppose as I hate fields full of modern rubbish. I dug two pot mends, two buttons and a musket ball by lunch, but just was not feeling the love for the place. So after lunch I was seriously thinking about calling it a day.
So often. By midday the rally car park is half empty.

The last swing of the day is as likely to produce a nice find as the first. The more hours the coil is to the soil, the greater the odds are you will find something nice.
I do normally stay till four and have only ever left a dig early once before that was when there was signals literally every few meters all modern and very deep. I went when someone local told me you will only find rubbish here as it was a dumping ground from when they built the motorway ;;z

Tomorrow I will have a long day.
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Pathfinder1977 »

oldartefact wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:30 pm
Pathfinder1977 wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:12 pm
I havent been to rallies or been in a club since the 1980s, so those costs dont affect me.

What! Do clubs really charge their own members per visit on club sites? Shocking! They never did that in my day - if you were a club member it was free (though our local club didnt invite non-members on as a rule, and it was up to the members to offer one of their own sites for club use - but only if they wanted to). I hope clubs are not offering the money they get this way to the farmers in order to enlist new sites. Thats bad because it encourages farmers to 'sell out to the highest bidder' and this hobby shouldnt be all about money (how ironic does that sound?).

The thing about rally prices creeping up and up is a common theme though. If you were a train enthusiast in the 1970s, admission to a rail depot open day was a few pence. In the next decades it started rising exponentially and today you see 20 pounds etc, though there arent many open days anymore because many depots have closed because modern locos need far less maintainance. I'll bet football and angling fans suffered the same experience too.

Sad sign of the times - money money money and the want of it is getting the upper hand the whole world over and it will be the finish of us...
Yes I guess charges for club sites is a slightly different issue... But for normal Sunday digs clubs up here generally charge a fiver ... it is "shocking" ... because that is arguably too low, and doesnt reward the farmer sufficiently ... The main issue is with some other outfits that charge "the sky is the limit subs" .. but while there are folk ready and willing to pay these sums, then they will charge it. That is the way of a free economy ... no rules, no tariffis .. and no deal, its sort of what we voted for, is it not?
The key is to become a "Marshall" for one of the "outfits" .. you wave the cars into the car park, get a free days dig, while the other guys are paying £20 a throw,
btw think that you've chosen a great name...
Thats a canny move oldartefact - and legal. Ive also heard of a rather dodgy way used to get people into antique fairs etc for free (ie carry an empty box into the event hall when all the traders are setting up so they think youre one of them, then hide in the toilets until opening time!).

Thanks for the compliment regarding the name. Pathfinder was the name I chose for my trusty C-Scope 950-D (you know, like people name their boats and sometimes cars). After all, the famous swords had names -Excalibur, Brainbiter- and isnt your detector a kind of modern (albeit electronic) sword? I punched the name onto a piece of black plastic Dymo tape and stuck that on the side of the control box, and because C-Scopes were always black then it even fooled another detectorist who thought I had some sort of 950 variant! LOL. I wonder how many others have named their machines...
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by oldartefact »

Phil2401 wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:57 pm
liamnolan wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:43 pm
Top class post as usual ::g Its too easy for me to say "go out and chat up a few farmers" but if you are living in Brixton or deepest darkest Manchester, Liverpool or any big city, then its not going to happen with a LOT of effort. The hobby belongs to ALL and I hope I have not in any way disrespected those who only have the rallies to rely on, you can still get a great days detecting if you learn which one to attend and which to avoid like the plague. Having said that, the social side is half the fun! Look out for the regular Charity Digs listed on here from time to time, the Rotary ones are usually good value and all proceeds to charity.
Good luck to all, Liam ::g
Nope - no disrespect noted or felt in your post, Liam - we're all in the same boat but from different generations of detectorists - I mean I'm probably older than you but a baby in terms of detecting experience - I recall toying with the idea of getting a metal detector in 1972, but was distracted by girls. We all make mistakes.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by bruno22rf »

Odd that some people are willing to pay £1000+ for a Detector but then baulk at the idea of paying £25 to use it.There is plenty of land to go around but I think that, these days, many people have simply forgotten the art of conversation and thus the ability to engage, comfortably, with others when asking for anything - approaching a stranger when you are not at your best gives a bad impression of you and makes chatting almost painful. Find an excuse to meet a landowner, learn a little about the type of farming he does - you don't need a degree in Milk production to chat about Cows and increased demand for higher fat content in milk. Don't pay thru the nose and eventually prices will have to come down and don't assume that Farmers who only let clubs on will not allow the odd individual a free roam - it's all about talking the right way to the right people.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by fred »

bruno22rf wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 12:41 am
Odd that some people are willing to pay £1000+ for a Detector but then baulk at the idea of paying £25 to use it.There is plenty of land to go around but I think that, these days, many people have simply forgotten the art of conversation and thus the ability to engage, comfortably, with others when asking for anything - approaching a stranger when you are not at your best gives a bad impression of you and makes chatting almost painful. Find an excuse to meet a landowner, learn a little about the type of farming he does - you don't need a degree in Milk production to chat about Cows and increased demand for higher fat content in milk. Don't pay thru the nose and eventually prices will have to come down and don't assume that Farmers who only let clubs on will not allow the odd individual a free roam - it's all about talking the right way to the right people.
Great points. ::g
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Junior »

chip wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 3:33 pm
Well today has been a tale of two digs. I went to dig A this morning and the fields were deadly quiet which was a plus I suppose as I hate fields full of modern rubbish. I dug two pot mends, two buttons and a musket ball by lunch, but just was not feeling the love for the place. So after lunch I was seriously thinking about calling it a day.

Then I remembered there was another dig being held literraly a few minutes away. I had already spent £25 getting into dig A but thought I could try my luck at dig B or go home. Dig B I am a regular at and would have infact ended up there if I hadn’t already committed to A before B advertised there dig. B normally costs £15 members £20 non members. I am not a member and only had £15 on me, therein lies the problem.

But I thought I am a regular, it’s gone 1 o’clock surely they will grant me a cheeky half day discount and accept £15 for the last few hours. “No mate was the answer, I explained I only had £15, again “no mate”, I was a bit disappointed as I said I am a regular on their digs, And even on first name terms with Rolo their dog, trouble was it was not Rolos decision to make. So it was home for an early bath :D

At least I found my first musket ball a dig A which sits perfectly on my first whorl I found last week at B’s dig.

::g
U saved yourself £15, as advertised it was VERY QUIET......9 targets in 5hrs

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Junior »

Till next time better luck ::g

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by f8met »

bruno22rf wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 12:41 am
Don't pay thru the nose and eventually prices will have to come down and don't assume that Farmers who only let clubs on will not allow the odd individual a free roam - it's all about talking the right way to the right people.
Some clubs rules specifically forbid you approaching the landowner direct and could mean being banned from future digs.

There is a local club to me about to fold so I guess the farmers whos land they let detect on will have a queue of people knocking on their doors.
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by bruno22rf »

You misunderstood me Dave - I have gained permission from Farmers whose land is supposedly only detected on by a certain club - one is "owned" by a really well known club. I do not belong to any club - I have more land than I know what to do with, I simply lack the time to get out and detect on it - I also do not pay - been on a couple of "Digs" a few years back and it's just a rip off.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Slantir »

I can imagine some clubs take advantage of "newbies". Take them to a field that has already been turned over. Gonna think twice before going on a dig.

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by chip »

Slantir wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:56 pm
I can imagine some clubs take advantage of "newbies". Take them to a field that has already been turned over. Gonna think twice before going on a dig.
The commercial organised digs operators want you to find good stuff, it’s what keeps you coming back and also what grows there business. It’s in there interest to try and find the best sites they can. But I find with detecting it’s better to have low expectations and then be pleasantly surprised when it’s your day to find something.

There could be a hundred staters in a field with a hundred detectorists and no one finds one yet another day there could be one and one person finds it. It’s like the lottery, you got to be in it to win it.
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Easylife »

littleboot wrote:
Thu Aug 02, 2018 7:04 pm
So the solution is to carry on in a quest for some of your own permissions while doing a few less of these digs.
::g
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Easylife »

Hi Chip, Why not just get your own permission and not have to compete with others at a great price for the finds? A saving in fuel and free detecting - what's not to like? Some local research to find a possible prospective site and as you like the social side just take some friends along - sorted. x;
It seems that MD rallies are just cashing in on the current trend and why not if people are willing to pay the price, that's just business of course which as said the market price is driven by the demand of rally goers themselves. Not sure that I would like to go to a commercial rally myself out of principal and of course the overpricing. But would be more than happy to support a charity rally where all of the profit goes to a good cause. ::g

Each to their own of course and clearly many are happy to fuel the price of convenience. x;
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Peej65 »

Yes, I won’t pay silly money to detect on land that is often useless or detected to death.
A rally I attended a few years ago was promoted with the organisers showing gold staters and lots of hammered found on this site. Unfortunately they used the same pictures for another rally on different land a bit later in the year. I suspect this goes on a fair bit.
I see rallies these days as a social event, just a chance to natter and have a laugh. Not for serious detecting. So I won’t pay ridiculous money! :D

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by jcmaloney »

chip wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 3:33 pm
Well today has been a tale of two digs. I went to dig A this morning and the fields were deadly quiet which was a plus I suppose as I hate fields full of modern rubbish. I dug two pot mends, two buttons and a musket ball by lunch, but just was not feeling the love for the place. So after lunch I was seriously thinking about calling it a day.

Then I remembered there was another dig being held literraly a few minutes away. I had already spent £25 getting into dig A but thought I could try my luck at dig B or go home. Dig B I am a regular at and would have infact ended up there if I hadn’t already committed to A before B advertised there dig. B normally costs £15 members £20 non members. I am not a member and only had £15 on me, therein lies the problem.

But I thought I am a regular, it’s gone 1 o’clock surely they will grant me a cheeky half day discount and accept £15 for the last few hours. “No mate was the answer, I explained I only had £15, again “no mate”, I was a bit disappointed as I said I am a regular on their digs, And even on first name terms with Rolo their dog, trouble was it was not Rolos decision to make. So it was home for an early bath :D

At least I found my first musket ball a dig A which sits perfectly on my first whorl I found last week at B’s dig.

::g
So I`ll take a guess..... went from Mark & Don`s (ex 3 Counties now trading as "The Detectorists") to Central Searchers then?

There are no "friends" in business as you learnt.

Dig A was probably concrete hard ground & stubble on the famous "Pump House" fields, with Dig B being on "The Stater Fields" at Pertenhall ....... both of which have been "frequently detected", so you get the pictures etc etc.... I`ve never seen anyone put stuff back. :))

Digs should have a simple description: Conditions, acreage and rough location.... the more hype they get the more its about "£££££££`s through the gate".

You would be better off not spending the thick end of £70 with fuel, food etc and seeing a local farmer, build rapport and build some local history. ::g
Opinions expressed on MY posts are mine and NOT those of any democratic organisation I volunteer for. ::g

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by littleboot »

There has been an influx into the hobby lately since the Staffs Hoard and also since the series on the telly. It goes in cycles....I remember how popular it was when I started in the 70's and then after a few years it kind of dropped off a bit.

The limiting factor, of course, has never been the equipment side of things. There have always been perfectly good machines that will do the job and to suit every pocket. So its easy to go out and buy one and then.....what? Waft around the garden, probably nip down to some woodland or common under the mistaken belief that it doesn't belong to anybody and doesn't require permission. But the P word is the sticky one. We all know it. Getting the courage, especially if you are not used to asking favours,and risking getting knocked back don't go with the dream. The rally business has found a way of making money out of catering for those who don't want to go through those hoops and secure their own permissions. Like any short-cut to success it is, of course, a road to no-where. There is never an easy option. If a rally is showing pictures of high-value finds then do the maths...they must be making more out of the rally than they would finding things themselves. If the field was littered with staters and hammereds then surely they would find them first. (And probably have.)

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You would be better off not spending the thick end of £70 with fuel, food etc and seeing a local farmer, build rapport and build some local history.
Spot on. I am gradually piecing together lots of bits of unrecorded history on my permissions. Spent a lovely time with a local farmer and his family having drinks on the lawn of his old farmhouse last Sunday. We took over a box of finds and showed and explained what we'd discovered and got some useful information on where to search in return. Its about building trust and rapport and above all time and patience is needed.
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Koala »

I did hint that paying farmers was a slippery slope a few year ago. As each year they will expect more and the word would soon spread.

It is the same with rallies. If someone charges £25 and is fully booked then when the word spreads they all will charge £25

I was out on Sunday I needed to be with in 2 miles of where the rally was taking place.

Cost £15 but included hot drinks, cans of pop, bottle of water and a BBQ.

The fact everyone gets togther at 12 for the BBQ means its much more of a social event with a chat.

By 12 I had found nothing. After a being refuelled with the BBQ off I go on round two

Somehow manged to save the day with a young Victoria 3 penny

Which goes back to another old thread about expectations. The higher to price the greater the expectations.

I can live with £15 for a BBQ, drink and about 50 targets to dig

I cant live with over £15 and a quite field that been done many times before

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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by fred »

I have been to many, many rallies over the years. Some were very good for reasons ranging from amazing finds to great socialising and others were pretty dire. The dire ones weren't always the organisers fault, often it was because of awful weather or because there simply wasn't much there to be found. Rallies are very much a lucky dip so all that you can do is to keep your expectations low, enjoy the taking part and give it your best shot. ::g
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by Devon steve »

As a newbie I've not really done the rally thing yet. I may not even. When you fork your cash what are you actually paying for? It makes no difference to the farmer if you detect there or not? He has nothing extra to pay for because of the usage? Additionally the guy organising the dig has no outgoings s such surely? Is a real shame it looks to be going this way. At the end of the day it's just a detectorist and a farmer. Should be no middle man making the money.
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Re: Have you been priced out.

Post by f8met »

Devon steve wrote:
Wed Aug 08, 2018 6:07 am
As a newbie I've not really done the rally thing yet. I may not even. When you fork your cash what are you actually paying for? It makes no difference to the farmer if you detect there or not? He has nothing extra to pay for because of the usage? Additionally the guy organising the dig has no outgoings s such surely? Is a real shame it looks to be going this way. At the end of the day it's just a detectorist and a farmer. Should be no middle man making the money.

It is a few quid in the farmers pocket, cash, for a days inconvenience. Hopefully just a day but if it is a good site then people may come back asking to detect or not depending on how honest they are.

Some commercial groups do have overheads such as making signs, running websites, hi-viz jackets, possible overnight stays, their time to find permissions and advertising in farming publications. So it is not quite like having your own permission which is essentially free.
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